one of the recent molest cases had a signed declaration of gerrit losch, stating he has no relation with watchtower and that he has no control over watchtower and he does not answer to watchtower.. this month he is hosting the watchtower broadcasting show, on a watchtower media chanel, with a watchtower president starring as co-host, with statements, media and music that have intellectual ownership and copyright by watchtower.. gerrit is asking on broadcasting for respect for “the slave”, just like jehova and jesus respect “the slave” and will even reward them.. are the writers of the statement too stupid to see the correlation between teaching and practicing?.
these man are proven liars.. how can hold this firewall stand?
it’s so thin.. a judge can see this mismach isn’t it??.
This post has a very good point to it. Of course the GB will say that the corporations are simply tools used by Jehovah's Witnesses to further the good news, and that GB members are not associated with those corporations.
Watchtower actually stated that Losch was akin to the Dalai Lama - a spiritual leader with no legal connections to those corporations.
as descibed by the title here is a link to reddit of a what i believe is a powerful post with heaps of information.
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https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/7ovq5o/watchtowers_decline_what_will_the_future_hold_for/?utm_source=reddit-android.
Thanks for the positive comments. I know that a few have asked for the source material -and I want everyone to know this is coming. We have to protect our sources, which is one reason I did not release this immediately as a JW Survey article. In fact - this was never meant to be an article. It was just a post that was intended for a different Facebook group. But I ended up just writing it all in a few minutes and posting it on my timeline, to express some feelings I had after reviewing many many hours of inside JW organizational videos. These JW materials quite honestly give me the creeps at times, as they focus so much on numbers, procedures, and obedience to the organization.
Some of the things I said would be things that I personally would have found hard to believe 5 or 10 years ago, when I was still in the organization. But having lived through that beaurocracy, and now seeing it from the outside, it is not surprising at all.
We will be seeing this source material released in the very near future, and I appreciate the patience of everyone who has asked where some of this info originated. There are many sources for the many leaks we receive, and I thank all of them for their willingness to make this religion as transparent as possible.
I will try to answer as many questions as I can. For those asking about the JW database - I will say that the organization has had several databases in use for several years now - such as the builder assist database of construction volunteers and overseers. I personally have exported such data from one overseer account, with over 2,000 personal files containing names, addresses, dates of birth and baptism, phone numbers, congregation and other information - and this was just for one small state.
In other words, I have proof of the data they are keeping on individuals. I find this to be a violation of my personal privacy, and most Witnesses do not know how much data is stored at the organizational HQ level.
Stay tuned, more to come on this subject
apparently they made this new corporation called the christian congregation of jehovah’s witnesses in the year 2001. this is the religious side of the cult and wtbts is the printing side and probably the money side.
since the gb think they are of the ccjw and have even stated their non affiliation with the wt is their a way that jws can use this to their advantage, maybe during a jc etc.?
i for example was baptized before 2000 so with the new corporation formed and the gb going to that side what could be argued during a jc?
Page 3
apparently they made this new corporation called the christian congregation of jehovah’s witnesses in the year 2001. this is the religious side of the cult and wtbts is the printing side and probably the money side.
since the gb think they are of the ccjw and have even stated their non affiliation with the wt is their a way that jws can use this to their advantage, maybe during a jc etc.?
i for example was baptized before 2000 so with the new corporation formed and the gb going to that side what could be argued during a jc?
@Zeb
This is page 2 of the 3 page declaration of Gerrit Losch
apparently they made this new corporation called the christian congregation of jehovah’s witnesses in the year 2001. this is the religious side of the cult and wtbts is the printing side and probably the money side.
since the gb think they are of the ccjw and have even stated their non affiliation with the wt is their a way that jws can use this to their advantage, maybe during a jc etc.?
i for example was baptized before 2000 so with the new corporation formed and the gb going to that side what could be argued during a jc?
For further clarification, CCJW is definitely used in other countries such as the UK. However in the UK it is not a charity. The lawsuits which are filed in the UK against the JW organization are filed against Watchtower of Britain, Watchtower of Pennsylvania, as well as the individual congregations involved.
I stay in close contact with the attorneys in the US, the UK and elsewhere, and even they have a tough time keeping up with all of the intricacies of the JW corporations. After the Fessler V Watchtower case in Philadelphia, I interviewed the jury as a group (10 jury members) - and asked them if they were confused by all of the various players involved (Watchtower, CCJW, the US Branch, etc) - and they unanimously exclaimed that they were very confused by all of these groups, which played a role in their opinion about Jehovah's Witnesses in general.
in my comedy i want to show the audience a large version of some weird front covers from the watchtower or awake.. do you have any suggestions?.
cheers.
paul.
@tahoe - Had to laugh at the Christmas cover, I recognized that scan right away - it was from my collection. Glad it's circulating around
day two (wednesday 8 february 2017).
see also posts and threads regarding: pre-trial / day one / day one update / day five (last day, settlement).
jefferson: not totally.. zeff: okay.
There are many issues at play here, but one of the core issues, which was also discussed in the Fessler trial, is the expectation of a member of clergy to report accusations of abuse to child protective services, and the police. This is a relatively simple issue.
However Watchtower intentionally complicates this issue, forcing elders to call the legal department instead of local authorities.
When a person becomes a member of the clergy (i.e. and elder) - there are very simple guidelines they can follow to make sure that the proper procedures are followed. There is a national website which allows anyone to click on the individual state and determine what the proper procedure is when there is a suspicion of child abuse. The side lists all mandatory reporters, and also gives a clear definition of exemptions from clergy privilege. The reality is that Watchtower legal department is not needed - what is needed is competent elders who follow the law whenever there is a report or confession of abuse. Elders are not allowed to think for themselves, which is a dangerous thing. Men who are window washers and carpet cleaners are dabbling in areas way beyond their experience. They are further prevented (or discouraged) by Watchtower from reporting certain matters because of Watchtower's policies.
An elder is supposed to be a shepherd, a judge, a leader - yet they are not allowed to think for themselves, and contact the police when necessary, and this is a recipe for absolute disaster.
During the Fessler trial, elder Hollingworth testified that he had no idea what clergy privilege was until he saw it mentioned on a TV show. He was utterly unprepared for how to handle such a serious matter. Watchtower argues that this is why they have a legal department. But this is not a valid argument when it comes to child abuse. The moment this information is shared with New York, and with other elders, clergy privilege is instantly violated - and for other reasons. There was no clergy privilege to begin with, since the elders went after Fessler and Monheim to conduct their own investigation. The private investigation which excluded civil authorities automatically killed their chance at claiming clergy privilege.
This is a no-win situation for Watchtower. Sadly, they could fix this problem very easily - but in so doing they would relinquish control over the actions of elders, and once they go down that road, the religion itself begins to fall apart. But - children must be protected, and if change comes at the expense of Watchtower, they only have themselves to blame. This has been going on for decades, but they insist on living by laws which are thousands of years old, antiquated and obsolete.
The next few years will see heavy activity in courtrooms across the US and elsewhere. Hopefully Watchtower will do the right thing and drastically revise their policies. The reality is, they have no choice.
JR
day two (wednesday 8 february 2017).
see also posts and threads regarding: pre-trial / day one / day one update / day five (last day, settlement).
jefferson: not totally.. zeff: okay.
For the record, I stated that a jury verdict could have resulted in a settlement of tens of millions, which would be followed by an appeal by Watchtower, which is well within their rights to do. Naturally we would expect that an appeal would take a significant amount of time, and possibly result in a reduction of the original amount awarded by the jury. We simply don't know, because this is hypothetical, and it never happened.
What did happen was that Watchtower settled for an undisclosed amount. That is the end of the story, and people are free to speculate all they want. I saw one blogger claim that she won 2 million dollars, but he admitted it was all speculation based on his personal experience with JW child abuse settlements. This means nothing. If the amount is not disclosed, then it is not disclosed. Period. All the guessing in the world will not give anyone the answer to this question.
Hence we need to concentrate on the facts. What happened both before and during the trial? Why did it happen? How does it relate to other cases? How will it affect Watchtower in future cases? How will it protect children in the future? Will awareness be heightened? Will Watchtower change its policies? These are all important questions which are open for discussion. Any settlement amount is not open for discussion.
In my case, I saw what happened, start to finish, and I will report the facts.
While I am certainly a supporter of Stephanie Fessler, I am also a supporter of truth an justice, which means I agree that Watchtower deserved a chance to defend itself in court. If they had provided evidence that they did indeed comply with state laws, I would have reported this, and you can be assured that the trial would have continued. However that is not what happened. We all know that Watchtower settled because they were unable, despite their best efforts, to defend themselves. They "cut their losses" and decided it was best to move on. This is their right, and they made an agreement which was accepted by the plaintiff.
At the beginning of this trial, judge Collins told the jury that she was the sole determiner of the law, but that the jury was the sole determiner of the facts of this case. The jury took this very seriously. Once the trial was complete, they voiced their opinions, and they made it clear that the elders and the organization had an obligation to report, but they failed to do so.
On multiple occasions, Watchtower attempted to object on 1st Amendment grounds, but was shut down every time. A strong message was sent that while religions have rights, they do not have the right to prevent a minor from receiving protection from civil authorities when there is a suspicion that they have been abused. The reality is that most religions agree with this, and they co-exist peacefully under the governments they are subject to.
Jehovah's Witnesses are a different animal. They are, according to their beliefs, not subject to any laws which oppose their interpretation of "Caesar's" laws, which is the source of their dilemmas. In the end, the powers which exist in this country and other civilized nations will, and are, prevailing against the dogmas which place our children, our minds, and our bodies at risk.
JR
day two (wednesday 8 february 2017).
see also posts and threads regarding: pre-trial / day one / day one update / day five (last day, settlement).
jefferson: not totally.. zeff: okay.
Fisherman - RE:
If Plaintiffs knew beforehand without a verdict from the Court that wt would be found legally liable by the Court, why did Plaintiffs agree to settle?
This is a complex issue since the settlement amount is not available to the public. What you have to understand is that in the end, the final decision is made by the victim, who is the Plaintiff, Stephanie Fessler. Whatever decision she makes to settle or not settle is her decision only. She feels that justice has been served, and so do I. The organization was held accountable for their mishandling of her case, and she wanted to send a message.
When all of us are held accountable for our actions, both personally and in religion or business, the world is a better place. In Stephanie's case, she would have, in my opinion, won a much larger amount, possibly in the tens of millions. However, Watchtower would have appealed, and this case would be tied up in the courts for a minimum of 2-3 years. There would have been hundreds and hundreds of files and documents generated over this period, and even with the judgment upheld, there Watchtower would find a way to delay the process as long as possible. I think she made the right decision. Not only was a final settlement reached, but we have four days of testimony from Watchtower, and thousands of pages of documents leading up to and including this trial, which we can review and discuss for years to come.
JR
day two (wednesday 8 february 2017).
see also posts and threads regarding: pre-trial / day one / day one update / day five (last day, settlement).
jefferson: not totally.. zeff: okay.
Thanks guys - I appreciate the comments. I have extensive information, which I will post on JW Survey, and I am sure that it will be transferred here as well as Reddit.
As for Stephanie, I have spoken to her quite a bit - she is a nice woman who truly was a victim here. No child should ever be denied the protection of the civil authorities who have decades of professional training, and who could have prevented the extreme trauma resulting from her abuse not being reported immediately.
Jehovah's Witnesses have a right to believe whatever they want as a religion, but when their members suffer due to the policies of this faith, we as a society have to draw the line and say no - we will not let this happen any longer.
JR
